topic Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title? in Discussions

How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

hzm1016 — Fri, 16 Dec 2022 01:28:03 GMT

I just updated to v 108 64-bit on MacOS and found that the list of windows in the Window pull-down is sorted alphabetically by window title. This is horrible, and I hope I can turn it off. I tried searching Firefox Help but no matter what I search for it only turns up articles about alphabetizing bookmarks.

The old behavior was that windows stayed in a fixed order in the Window pull-down for the duration of a Firefox instance. I have "Open previous windows and tabs" turned on, and that also kept the very first window the same all the time, even though the other windows might move around when restarting Firefox.

Now, every time I click on a link or move to a different tab, the window moves to someplace completely different in the Window list. I often have no idea what the "window title" is, so I don't even know what I am looking for in the list. Also, for example, some web pages log me out after some period of inactivity, and what they choose to give as the title of their login page is not under my control, either.

I sure hope there is a way to restore the previous behavior in the Settings. But all searches in Firefox Help for "alphabetical" and "window" return ONLY articles on alphabetizing the bookmarks.

The only way this "feature" would be of any use to me would be if I could set a persistent title for each window, like "Webmail" "Facebook" "NYTimes" "Games" etc, and have that be the key for alphabetizing, NOT some fleeting string picked by some capricious web page code.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Sat, 17 Dec 2022 21:19:43 GMT

Same question. If no answer, I'll go back to Safari… Who had such a stupid idea ?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

hzm1016 — Sun, 18 Dec 2022 06:19:01 GMT

I also just discovered that downgrading back to v107 totally screwed me. I get a warning that downgrading "may" corrupt bookmarks, etc. and I am only given two choices: (1) create a new, empty, profile; or (2) quit. I do not get the option to try using the profile anyway, and yet I see nothing that indicates that any changes to the profile format has been made between v107 and v108, just that it "may" have changed.

So, I cannot get back to the state I was in before the idiotic change in v108 was unceremoniously foisted on the user community.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Sun, 18 Dec 2022 14:55:28 GMT

It's a crazy story : you spend your time looking for where the window is in the list and you can't downgrade to avoid this !!!

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 16 Jan 2023 17:51:54 GMT

I run Windows, so I can't test the following. Could one of you test whether the following add-on provides a workaround:

https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/window-titler/

Nine days later...

I posted an add-on that auto-numbers windows that you could try instead:

https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/auto-number-windows/

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 19 Dec 2022 06:58:57 GMT

@hzm1016 wrote:
I do not get the option to try using the profile anyway, and yet I see nothing that indicates that any changes to the profile format has been made between v107 and v108, just that it "may" have changed.

There is a section about "downgrade protection" in the following support article (see "What happens to my profile if I downgrade to a previous version of Firefox?"): https://support.mozilla.org/kb/dedicated-profiles-firefox-installation

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Mon, 19 Dec 2022 14:48:43 GMT

Thanks, jscher2000 !
Window-titler works on macOS. It's an improvement… It's less difficult to find your window.

But who at Mozilla could have had this idea to sort the windows in alphabetic order ???

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

EricD — Thu, 22 Dec 2022 21:09:08 GMT

This is horrible. It will slow me down considerably. Alphabetizing a list of arbitrary strings that can change at any moment is really bad UX.

Has no one found a way to revert this behavior yet?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Thu, 22 Dec 2022 21:29:33 GMT

It remains to be hoped that Mozilla reads this subject and corrects his error ...

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

ajbjr518 — Fri, 23 Dec 2022 20:17:49 GMT

i went to firefox because i had this problem with safari?! is it possible to unalphebetize windows in safari?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

ajbjr518 — Fri, 23 Dec 2022 20:57:01 GMT

i moved to firefox because safari has this problem. chrome has the same problem. it makes me think fondly back to my old dell which ran microsoft windows. does anyone know any other browser which allows windows to stay in a fixed order? this really is my number one priority in choosing a browser. i keep about 10 windows each with about 10 tabs open, and i now spend more time looking for lost windows than i want to admit.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

hzm1016 — Sat, 24 Dec 2022 20:09:52 GMT

This does work so I marked it as a solution. But it remains the case that it is only a somewhat inconvenient workaround for a truly terrible change in v108.

Here's the problem:

This workaround requires that the user manually invoke the addon and then type in a name. The old behavior was far superior in that the user could just rely on the order of the windows remaining constant.

If ANYTHING in this area needs fixing, it would be (A) to add a way for the USER to rearrange the windows (in their otherwise fixed order), and (B) to have Firefox remember that order through restarts (when "Open previous windows and tabs" is enabled for Startup in Settings).

The change in v108 to randomly play "52 card pickup" with the window order was completely unnecessary and not at all thought out. It adds nothing good to the user experience.

IT SHOULD BE REVERTED.

If some user really wants it, make it an option in Settings -- and NOT the default. I will be happy to propose this in the bugs/feature-suggestions/regressions database if someone will tell me how I can do that.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 26 Dec 2022 19:52:24 GMT

@hzm1016 wrote:
If some user really wants it, make it an option in Settings -- and NOT the default. I will be happy to propose this in the bugs/feature-suggestions/regressions database if someone will tell me how I can do that.

Hmm, this is a difficult situation. In order to implement some context menu options ("Tile Window to Left/Right of Screen" and "Move to [SCREEN]"), Firefox now lets Mac OS control of the Windows menu order, and I assume that is why it is strictly on the window title (which in turn is based on the tab/page title, preceded by any "preface" added by an add-on).

Add-ons can determine the index number of a window (which increments in the order the window was opened) as well as the date/time it was opened, which means an add-on could automatically add a "preface" rather than having the user assign a name. So let's call that the "window sequence number" for ease of reference. I think adding such a number before the tab/page title would keep the list stable. So along those lines, you could:

(1) Create a new thread in the "Ideas" section of this site to gather kudos for the product people to prioritize that idea at some point

(2) Submit a bug on Bugzilla for the developer who manages whatever part of the UI is involved to prioritize that idea at some point -- this might not go anywhere without impetus from product people because it would be quite different than what people are used to seeing

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 26 Dec 2022 21:39:47 GMT

By the way, I created an add-on to auto-number windows and submitted it to the Add-ons site. It probably won't be available until tomorrow at the earliest due to the holiday.

I will need some help testing it because I run Windows. My initial questions are:

(1) If you have, say, 12 windows open, does the menu appear in numerical order (9, 10, 11, 12) or text order (1, 10, 11, 12, 2)?

(2) Should regular and private windows be numbered in separate sequences? I don't know whether they all appear together on the menu or whether there will be weird gaps.

If you want to try it out now before it is approved, there is a way to do it. Depends on whether you are in a hurry.

(The code is available here: https://github.com/jscher2000/firefox-window-autonumber)

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Tue, 27 Dec 2022 23:02:19 GMT

I'm not sure who will be notified of this reply, but I posted an add-on to try to help with this problem. Since I run Windows, I'm not sure what improvements it might need so I look forward to your feedback if you try it:

https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/auto-number-windows/

You can reply here, or contact me by email at jscher2000@outlook.com, or if you have a Github account (or don't mind creating one), you can post an issue at https://github.com/jscher2000/firefox-window-autonumber/issues.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Tue, 27 Dec 2022 23:13:00 GMT

Oh, but it sounds excellent ! Thank you jscher2000 !
It looks to work well under mas os !

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Tue, 27 Dec 2022 23:43:21 GMT

@GeorgesPN wrote:
Oh, but it sounds excellent ! Thank you jscher2000 !
It looks to work well under mas os !

Thank you for testing. As you work with it, could you let me know if there is a problem when there are more than 10 windows (does 11 sort before 2), and if the numbering of private windows is okay or needs to be its own series.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Wed, 28 Dec 2022 10:42:54 GMT

No problem with the order (21 windows opened). But After a while, the add-on ceases to work.As there is no button, I have to uninstall, then reinstall, and, again, it works properly. Stabiity problem.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Wed, 28 Dec 2022 17:57:37 GMT

@GeorgesPN wrote:
No problem with the order (21 windows opened). But After a while, the add-on ceases to work.As there is no button, I have to uninstall, then reinstall, and, again, it works properly. Stabiity problem.

You also could try disabling and re-enabling the extension on the Add-ons page (Command+Shift+A), Extensions panel.

My guess is that one of the functions crashes due to a situation I didn't plan for. If you notice any pattern to when it stops happening, it would be useful to know what kind of create/close operations were done right before that.

I should add a button to regenerate the numbering. Not sure whether it deserves a full toolbar button, but users can always move it to the "Overflow" button. Or it could be a right-click context menu item somewhere.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Wed, 28 Dec 2022 18:43:04 GMT

I found this : the bug occurs when opening a new window or a new tab.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Wed, 28 Dec 2022 19:42:24 GMT

@GeorgesPN wrote:
I found this : the bug occurs when opening a new window or a new tab.

What happens when you reach this point of failure? For example:

the add-on it didn't number the new window; numbering is frozen
numbering is scattered/random (out of order)
numbering removed from all the windows

I submitted a simplified version of the add-on that doesn't try to maintain a list of window numbers to minimize the number of preface updates as windows are added/removed. Instead, it just renumbers everything every time a window is added or removed. This could slightly reduce performance, but has fewer potential points of failure.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Wed, 28 Dec 2022 19:54:36 GMT

Numbering removed from all the windows.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jrwilson13 — Thu, 29 Dec 2022 04:28:56 GMT

Throwing in my $0.02. I agree this behavior is horrible. I run MacOS on an older machine. You can get an alphabetical list of Firefox windows by right-clicking on the Firefox icon in the Dock. The same behavior does not need to be replicated with the Window drop down menu. Having the drop down menu list windows in the order of creation is a great feature. I also want this behavior reverted to the old way. Is there a bug filed on this? If so, how do I vote for it to be fixed?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Thu, 29 Dec 2022 06:21:20 GMT

@jrwilson13 wrote:
Is there a bug filed on this? If so, how do I vote for it to be fixed?

A bug was filed, but at this point the decision was not to revert the changes -- they were made to support "Tile Window to Left/Right of Screen" and "Move to [SCREEN]" and that involved surrendering the menu ordering to Mac OS.

One workaround would be to number the windows so that as the tab title changes, the position stays the same. I don't know whether this would ever become a built-in option. For now, you could try my add-on and see whether it works for you:

https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/auto-number-windows/

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jrwilson13 — Fri, 30 Dec 2022 05:00:46 GMT

Thanks, I will try your add-on since it looks like there is no hope of Firefox reverting to the previous behavior. My wife sometimes uses my computer (on the same account) so between the two of us there are a _lot_ of Firefox windows open and not being able to depend on them to be in a specific order makes it really hard to find what I want.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Mon, 02 Jan 2023 21:39:43 GMT

Numbering disappears when a new window is opened.
So do this : create a new window then close it.
Magic: numbering reappears !

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Tue, 03 Jan 2023 00:24:11 GMT

@GeorgesPN wrote:
Numbering disappears when a new window is opened.
So do this : create a new window then close it.
Magic: numbering reappears !

I wish I could explain why the renumbering works when you close a window but not when you open one. It's the same code that runs in either case.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

hzm1016 — Tue, 03 Jan 2023 02:54:51 GMT

Can you point us to the bug so we can chime in on it? Is there any good reason why this cannot be a checkbox in Settings so that those of us who have no use for "Tile Window to..." and have relied on the old behavior for years can choose to enable the old behavior?

Your add-on "works" but lt is inconvenient compared to the old behavior -- the user has to manually choose and type in a title for each window. And the user also has to remember to do that each time a new window is opened.

I just realized that you have created a second add-on. I have been using the window-titler, and now there is an auto-number-windows. Do I need to uninstall or disable the first one to install the second one? Do I need to do anything other than install it, or will installing it simply result in the titles being generated as sequential numbers? Can I use both add-ons so that each window gets its sequential number, and then I have the option of renaming them using window-titler if I choose to do so?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Tue, 03 Jan 2023 07:09:31 GMT

@hzm1016 wrote:
I just realized that you have created a second add-on. I have been using the window-titler, and now there is an auto-number-windows. Do I need to uninstall or disable the first one to install the second one? Do I need to do anything other than install it, or will installing it simply result in the titles being generated as sequential numbers? Can I use both add-ons so that each window gets its sequential number, and then I have the option of renaming them using window-titler if I choose to do so?

I think they will conflict and using them together will cause unpredictable behavior. But since I don't have a Mac, I haven't tried it.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

shawna — Thu, 05 Jan 2023 17:28:21 GMT

Really hoping the next Firefox update returns the list of Windows back to "order opened" instead of Alpha order. This is brutal. Every new window opened shifts the order around. Websites are titled in all sorts of inconsistent ways. I'm spending so much time hunting for browser windows in my drop down list...

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Thu, 05 Jan 2023 21:45:04 GMT

Shawna, use = https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/auto-number-windows/
There is a little bug : when you open a new window, the list i again in alphabetical order. Then do the following : create a new window, and then, close it. Magic the list is in "order opened".
I'm sur jsher2000 will correct this problem…

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

dmachak — Fri, 06 Jan 2023 17:10:02 GMT

I also find this new behavior non-intuitive and confusing. My workflow involves opening multiple windows, each for a different purpose, and the fixed order allowed me to quickly change contexts. Now it's a crapshoot.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 19:06:48 GMT

Are any of you running into problems with open windows missing from your Window menu? If so, there is a new thread on that: Windows Missing in "Window" menu and it would be helpful if you could add your experience there.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Sun, 08 Jan 2023 16:34:58 GMT

Same code when opening or closing a window ? May be the call to the routine is deficient when opening…

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Tue, 10 Jan 2023 05:00:06 GMT

It's hard for me to judge. Could you check for error messages as follows:

(1) Type or paste about:debugging#/runtime/this-firefox in the address bar and press Return to open that page.

Firefox should list all your active add-ons.

(2) Click the Inspect button for the Auto-number Windows add-on

Firefox should pop up a new window or open a new tab. Click the little "Console" tab. This is where you'll check for error messages when something goes wrong with the add-on.

(3) Use the add-on and check the console any time something goes wrong.

Anything there?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GeorgesPN — Tue, 10 Jan 2023 18:19:58 GMT

I'm sorry, but nothing, no message in the console.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 16 Jan 2023 01:03:36 GMT

@GeorgesPN wrote:
I'm sorry, but nothing, no message in the console.

Hmm, okay, in version 0.3 I added an extra check into the code to see whether Firefox is providing the add-on an empty window list for some reason. That might show up or it might not. Also, I added "Renumber windows list" to the Tools menu. That might not be faster than Command+N Command+W but at least it's an option.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 16 Jan 2023 17:50:29 GMT

To vote for a change, check out this thread over on the "Ideas" side of this site:

Order of windows in the Window dropdown menu should be controlable in preferences

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

td4544 — Tue, 07 Feb 2023 05:47:07 GMT

edit: posted this reply in the ideas thread.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

hzm1016 — Tue, 07 Feb 2023 14:36:59 GMT

<<I would delete this if I could figure out how to do that>>

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

hzm1016 — Tue, 07 Feb 2023 14:43:53 GMT

If you found this thread that I created after the disastrous window scrambling change in v108, instead of commenting here you need to go to the "ideas" thread on this topic and UPVOTE IT. Get your friends to upvote it, too.

Here is the link:

https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/ideas/order-of-windows-in-the-window-dropdown-menu-should-be/idi-p/22200

Note, also, that user jscher2000 has posted a workaround in one of the early comments on this thread. It is a browser add-on that allows you to give a window a permanent name. It does require that you click on its button and type in the title you want. It does seem to generally work, but you do have to manually name each window.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Sun, 19 Feb 2023 13:23:03 GMT

@jscher2000 wrote:
A bug was filed, but at this point the decision was not to revert the changes -- they were made to support "Tile Window to Left/Right of Screen" and "Move to [SCREEN]" and that involved surrendering the menu ordering to Mac OS.

That makes no sense to me. Since when surrendering anything to Mac OS, hence to Apple, is a good move?

Nick

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Wed, 01 Mar 2023 16:19:28 GMT

Excellent, the numbers look a little unusual if not odd but at least it works and it's stable.

Thanks for the solution.

Nick

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Wed, 01 Mar 2023 22:24:07 GMT

@Saint112 wrote:
Excellent, the numbers look a little unusual if not odd but at least it works and it's stable.

It's definitely not normal to have window numbers, but if you mean there are unexpected gaps or they sort out of order, I could take a look at that.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Sun, 12 Mar 2023 16:44:38 GMT

I got used to the system, yet it has its drawbacks:

The Window menu was chronologically sorted.
The Dock (the equivalent of but not fully similar to the Task Bar) menu was alphabetically sorted.

It was very handy: you could use one of the other according to how you identified the windows. For example I keep open both the English and the French versions of Wikipedia. Since in the Window menu they would go up and down randomly I used to get them in the Dock menu where they were constantly listed at the bottom. We had the best of both worlds.

Now both menus are sorted identically.

Good job anyway

Nick

P.S. I never get notified of new messages. The "Email me when someone replies" box is checked. In my profile page there is my correct email address. How can I fix that?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Sun, 12 Mar 2023 19:23:46 GMT

@Saint112 wrote:
I got used to the system, yet it has its drawbacks:
The Window menu was chronologically sorted.
The Dock (the equivalent of but not fully similar to the Task Bar) menu was alphabetically sorted.
It was very handy: you could use one of the other according to how you identified the windows. For example I keep open both the English and the French versions of Wikipedia. Since in the Window menu they would go up and down randomly I used to get them in the Dock menu where they were constantly listed at the bottom. We had the best of both worlds.
Now both menus are sorted identically.
Good job anyway

I am working on a toolbar button to show the list in "opened" order even if you don't use the numbers. That might be helpful for you. It's not done yet.

<several hours later> version 0.5 is live on the site now with a "numberless" option for the toolbar button dialog -- check the full set of screenshots for instructions, but here's a sneak peek.

P.S. I never get notified of new messages. The "Email me when someone replies" box is checked. In my profile page there is my correct email address. How can I fix that?

If you aren't subscribed -- if this reply doesn't move the thread up to the top of the https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/user/myprofilepage/tab/user-subscriptions -- click the "Options" link near the top of this page and click Subscribe on the drop-down. If you are already subscribed, hmm, I wonder whether your email service provider is putting them in spam?

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Sun, 12 Mar 2023 23:04:38 GMT

@jscher2000 wrote:
I am working on a toolbar button to show the list in "opened" order even if you don't use the numbers. That might be helpful for you. It's not done yet.

Do you mean it would be an ON/OFF button? That would be great! Actually the great thing would be to not affect the Dock menu that would remain in alphabetical order. So it would be a reversion to the old situation. I am looking forward to it!

P.S. I never get notified of new messages. The "Email me when someone replies" box is checked. In my profile page there is my correct email address. How can I fix that?
If you aren't subscribed -- if this reply doesn't move the thread up to the top of the https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/user/myprofilepage/tab/user-subscriptions -- click the "Options" link near the top of this page and click Subscribe on the drop-down. If you are already subscribed, hmm, I wonder whether your email service provider is putting them in spam?

Well, I have a profile so I am a subscriber. I had not gone to the https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/user/myprofilepage/tab/user-subscriptions page. I didn't know one had to. I checked the box of the discussion. We will see the result.
Nick

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Mon, 13 Mar 2023 06:40:39 GMT

@Saint112 wrote:
@jscher2000 wrote:
I am working on a toolbar button to show the list in "opened" order even if you don't use the numbers. That might be helpful for you. It's not done yet.
Do you mean it would be an ON/OFF button? That would be great! Actually the great thing would be to not affect the Dock menu that would remain in alphabetical order. So it would be a reversion to the old situation. I am looking forward to it!

Hi Nick, I can't fix the Firefox "Window" menu, but I can give you a panel with a custom list in created order. That option is live now. If needed, you can trigger an update on the built-in Add-ons page (Command+Shift+A) using the "wheel"/"gear" button > Check for Updates.

Then use the Extensions button to access the new toolbar button and pin it to the toolbar:

You can use Customize to move that to a different bar if you like. https://support.mozilla.org/kb/customize-firefox-controls-buttons-and-toolbars

Go to the Tools menu to turn OFF the numbering (sometimes I need to run it twice for some reason):

Your dock list should return to its default, the Window menu will return to its Firefox 108+ default (alphabetical), and the new toolbar button drop-down will list the windows in "created" order. (As a Windows person, I can't make confirm those things or make screenshots of them...)

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Tue, 14 Mar 2023 13:52:21 GMT

@jscher2000 wrote:
Hi Nick, I can't fix the Firefox "Window" menu, but I can give you a panel with a custom list in created order. That option is live now. If needed, you can trigger an update on the built-in Add-ons page (Command+Shift+A) using the "wheel"/"gear" button > Check for Updates.
Then use the Extensions button to access the new toolbar button and pin it to the toolbar:

The Windows (from MS) environment is probably different from the Mac OS one. In the Add-ons Manager page when I click on the Auto-number Windows I get the regular local menu with none of the options that are on your image.

Nick

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Tue, 14 Mar 2023 16:29:00 GMT

@Saint112 wrote:
@jscher2000 wrote:
Hi Nick, I can't fix the Firefox "Window" menu, but I can give you a panel with a custom list in created order. That option is live now. If needed, you can trigger an update on the built-in Add-ons page (Command+Shift+A) using the "wheel"/"gear" button > Check for Updates.
Then use the Extensions button to access the new toolbar button and pin it to the toolbar:
The Windows (from MS) environment is probably different from the Mac OS one. In the Add-ons Manager page when I click on the Auto-number Windows I get the regular local menu with none of the options that are on your image.

Hi Nick, the key thing you need is the toolbar button. Starting recently, the Extension button should have a drop-down that lists all of your installed extensions so you can pin the button from there. If it instead flips you over to the Add-ons page, is it possible you went into about:config and switched "extensions.unifiedExtensions.enabled" to false? If so, that will stop working in Firefox 111, but until then, the toolbar button should be somewhere else, whether on the bar or in the classic overflow menu (>> button) or in the available buttons box on the Customize page.

Ref. https://support.mozilla.org/kb/customize-firefox-controls-buttons-and-toolbars

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Sat, 04 Nov 2023 23:54:49 GMT

I am sorry to say that the Auto-number Windows - stable menu order is not stable at all. I doesn't load by itself. To start it I have to go in the Add-ons Manager, first disable it, wait a couple of minutes then reenable it.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Sun, 05 Nov 2023 01:30:03 GMT

@Saint112 wrote:
I am sorry to say that the Auto-number Windows - stable menu order is not stable at all. I doesn't load by itself. To start it I have to go in the Add-ons Manager, first disable it, wait a couple of minutes then reenable it.

Hmm, it's hard for me to test because it seems fine on Windows.

I posted an update to try to initialize or re-initialize on Startup. Hopefully that will kick it into gear.

Also, if you have the problem that it stops numbering, check the Tools menu and try

Auto-number Windows > Renumber windows now

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Sun, 05 Nov 2023 22:48:53 GMT

Thanks for your quick reply.

You say "Auto-number Windows > Renumber windows now". Where is this feature.

Actually this solution is not really satisfying. On top of that on Mac when I disable the re-enable the add-on the existing windows are numbered but the subsequently opened windows are not. So it's rather useless. I have suggestions for another type of add-on:

Create a new menu with the windows ordered chronologically. Call it ChroWin or ChronoWindo or WinTwo for example. The icing on the cake would be to create submenus with the lists of the tabs of each window.
Create a floating menu. It could actually be yet another window listing all the windows. List the tabs as well.

So we could eat the cake and still have it: a) this feature would display the windows chronologically and the existing menu and b) the Dock on MacOS would display them alphabetically.

BTW, I suppose there is another feature related to this one: when choosing Restore Previous Session, the windows are not displayed as they were before. I created about this topic another thread: When choosing Restore Previous Session windows are tiled. This is very annoying too.

Regards

Nick

P.S.

I can't find how to make quotes.

I don't get notifications of responses.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Sun, 05 Nov 2023 23:27:15 GMT

Hi Nick, after clicking the blue Reply button, there should be a " button on the same bar as B I and so on.

You say "Auto-number Windows > Renumber windows now". Where is this feature.

The Tools menu, at the bottom. If this is missing from the bottom of the Tools menu, the add-on did not start up properly. I don't know what would cause that.

Actually this solution is not really satisfying. On top of that on Mac when I disable the re-enable the add-on the existing windows are numbered but the subsequently opened windows are not. So it's rather useless. I have suggestions for another type of add-on:
Create a new menu with the windows ordered chronologically. Call it ChroWin or ChronoWindo or WinTwo for example. The icing on the cake would be to create submenus with the lists of the tabs of each window.
Create a floating menu. It could actually be yet another window listing all the windows. List the tabs as well.
So we could eat the cake and still have it: a) this feature would display the windows chronologically and the existing menu and b) the Dock on MacOS would display them alphabetically.

This add-on has an optional dialog (its button should be on the "puzzle piece" menu and you can use the gear button to pin it to the toolbar) that lists the windows in the correct order. To use the dialog with the numbering off, you can use:

(menu bar) Tools > Auto-number Windows > Turn off auto-numbering

I was thinking about adding tabs, but I'm not sure how many people would use it. I use this dialog but I have over 100 tabs open so I'm not sure I would want to see those there. But I hope eventually to expand the search feature to filter the list by all tab titles in a window instead of just the active tab title.

BTW, I suppose there is another feature related to this one: when choosing Restore Previous Session, the windows are not displayed as they were before. I created about this topic another thread: When choosing Restore Previous Session windows are tiled. This is very annoying too.

Yes, that occurs on Windows, too. There is a bug report on file from a while ago, maybe last year. Not sure anyone has figured out exactly what causes the problem.

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

Saint112 — Thu, 09 Nov 2023 13:59:10 GMT

@jscher2000 wrote:
Hi Nick, after clicking the blue Reply button, there should be a " button on the same bar as B I and so on.

How come on certain forums such features are just straightforward, and on others you need to ask, and once you have the answer you still need to find out how to make easily a partial quote.

@jscher2000 wrote:
The Tools menu, at the bottom. If this is missing from the bottom of the Tools menu, the add-on did not start up properly. I don't know what would cause that.

OK. I got it. I was looking in the so-called Application Menu. Some years ago I was looking for something and someone told me to look in the hamburger menu. The what? I had not yet realized that computer applications had been contaminated by smartphone apps. There is plenty of space in the menu bar, why the heck add a cryptic menu in such an improbable location?

I dismissed the last upgrade. I am always worried about what's in store in new versions. I wish I had not upgraded since a couple of years. I regretted it each time.

@jscher2000 wrote:
I was thinking about adding tabs, but I'm not sure how many people would use it. I use this dialog but I have over 100 tabs open so I'm not sure I would want to see those there. But I hope eventually to expand the search feature to filter the list by all tab titles in a window instead of just the active tab title.

When there are submenus the user can pass them when scrolling the menu. You can also make it optional.

Nick

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

GreenMind — Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:59:42 GMT

This is still really frustrating to me. When I first noticed it I assumed it was a bug that would be fixed quickly, but here we are in version 119 and I have just discovered the discussion about it.

My biggest gripe is about how Firefox currently lists email website. Whenever I open an email the Firefox window list changes to use the subject line of the email, which could be literally anything. I have to think back on what email I was last looking at to find my email website. I tried to use the workaround add-ons, but they have problems too.

First, Window Titler is a great idea, but it doesn't remember the title after you close the window, let alone between sessions. If I close the window and reopen it, I have to rename my email window. If I have two windows open to the same website, it only renames one of them. It would be great if it remembered which website the name belongs to after closing the window, and even better if it remembered between sessions.

Auto Number Windows seems flaky. When I tried to use it, it put up a dialog asking to set permissions for getting info about tabs, but then didn't do any numbering.

The basic idea of alphabetizing the window names is not inherently bad, but when the names are constantly changing it is a problem. I wonder if it could be actually become a really useful feature by naming the window after the name of the home page, and then appending whatever page it is on. The home page title will be very stable, and then the page name will make it really easy to figure out which window using that website to go to.

For example, a window showing the YouTube home page will simply say "YouTube". Currently if you have a page showing a YouTube video, it will use the title first, then the website. For example, "Is Nuclear Energy Green? - YouTube". That is a useless way to list it. I want to see "YouTube - Is Nuclear Energy Green?" and have all my YouTube windows listed together.

It seems like it might be a simple thing to list all windows with the name of the home page first. A YouTube video window would come up with the "YouTube" first instead of last. (Maybe even with "YouTube" both first and last, if the website is also appending its home page title to the page name.) If Firefox can get the title of the website from its home page, that would not only solve the problem but improve on the previous condition. Even before the problem started, I had to decide whether that weird item in the list was the subject line of an email or the title of a YouTube video.

In my experience as a software developer, I know that there are often hidden obstacles to making a change like this (like trying to conform to Apple's interface) , but I hope there is some way of doing something like this.

Thanks,

Ben

Re: How can i disable the new v108 "feature" that alphabetizes windows by title?

jscher2000 — Sun, 19 Nov 2023 00:16:02 GMT

Hi Ben, first, sorry this isn't working as designed:

@GreenMind wrote:
Auto Number Windows seems flaky. When I tried to use it, it put up a dialog asking to set permissions for getting info about tabs, but then didn't do any numbering.

There is an addition to the Tools menu to force immediate renumbering, in case that helps:

(menu bar) Tools > Auto-number Windows > Renumber windows now

The basic idea of alphabetizing the window names is not inherently bad, but when the names are constantly changing it is a problem. I wonder if it could be actually become a really useful feature by naming the window after the name of the home page, and then appending whatever page it is on. The home page title will be very stable, and then the page name will make it really easy to figure out which window using that website to go to.
For example, a window showing the YouTube home page will simply say "YouTube". Currently if you have a page showing a YouTube video, it will use the title first, then the website. For example, "Is Nuclear Energy Green? - YouTube". That is a useless way to list it. I want to see "YouTube - Is Nuclear Energy Green?" and have all my YouTube windows listed together.
It seems like it might be a simple thing to list all windows with the name of the home page first. A YouTube video window would come up with the "YouTube" first instead of last. (Maybe even with "YouTube" both first and last, if the website is also appending its home page title to the page name.) If Firefox can get the title of the website from its home page, that would not only solve the problem but improve on the previous condition. Even before the problem started, I had to decide whether that weird item in the list was the subject line of an email or the title of a YouTube video.
In my experience as a software developer, I know that there are often hidden obstacles to making a change like this (like trying to conform to Apple's interface) , but I hope there is some way of doing something like this.

As a software developer, you could consider creating a user script for this. A userscript engine like Tampermonkey, Violentmonkey, Greasemonkey or FireMonkey can insert your script into every site (other than certain off limits Mozilla sites). If I think about how it this might work, you could grab the site's host name and inject it at the beginning of the page title:

document.title = location.hostname + ' | ' + document.title;

The problem arises when the page changes the title, there is a lot of additional code involved in detecting and responding to that.

And obviously it would be nicer if it were just the second level domain rather than the entire host name, or maybe have some configurable substitutions like mail.google.com => Gmail.

Could be an interesting add-on project.